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Forum Oi! → Chit-Chat → Evergreen College—What causes a social school wide meltdown?

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1


Whoops, this was the video i wanted to get in where i said there was a couple swears, the one there is innocent just funny lol. Here is the video, from a person living in the middle of it.
https://www.youtube.com/wat...
The photo you see here is of the campus watch student police force, a true group of fanatical SJWs you wouldn't believe exist unless you research their very public approach to anarchy.

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This is an older story
But it bears repeating that it is only one of dozens in the last year that has basically signaled the end of Western civilization. These people are less compatible with pluralistic democracy, than Muslims who practice Sharia Law.

3

Evergreen has always been in the forefront of educational experiments. And this particular experiment has worked just fine for several years.
And it might have worked this time. Except that the atmosphere surrounding these issues is so flammable these days that some sort of flareup was inevitable.
Keep in mind that the students were riding a wave of internet approbation as hundreds of folks with no skin in the game high-fived them virtually and right-oned with abandon.

4

As far as I can tell, from reading various articles and watching the videos, it seems to be the simple mindset of "I am a person of color, thus everyone is out to get me". Looking into the released e-mail, the statements about what the objections actually were, and the frankly ridiculous nature of many of the so-called protests, I can't even say that it started as a reasonable grievance. The professor objected to a change made to the Day of Absence/Day of Presence. He did not object to the day itself, or the message it sent, just the change, which he felt was unnecessary and sent the wrong message. In response to a polite e-mail exchange, the students decided to take it upon themselves to form a mob and storm his classroom.
From there, it escalated via pure mob mentality. "We can scream and shout, and because everyone else is acting civil, we feel like we actually have some power." Like children whose parents scold them but don't follow through on punishments, they saw that acting out wasn't going to be punished, and continued to escalate their behavior. None of the grievances aired were based in reality, they were based in victim mentality.

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<a>NOTE: MODERATOR Lord Circe has previously sent invitations to this discussion</a>.  Invitations sent—would you please also include a few right/wrong and/or morals and ethics questions regarding this issue, Haseo-sama?

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The weather is so hot such that the matches in the tinderbox lit themselves up.

7

I just realized lord circle did it too, my bad man. But i added a few questions! Honestly though, I want to word it like you and circle do but I need some practice lol

8

Yes you do.  No, hahahaa. I will edit it for you if you want.

9

Please, Smiley-sama. I would very much appreciate that, and consider it a good learning post for discussion format vs. what just comes to mind. etc. smile

10

well a couple of fact about this "play" this play was taken and copied off a short story by ray bradbury. in my opinion one of the greatest science fiction writers ,ever. [my opinion, and i stick with it.] and this colledge student took it copied it quite a bit. and used it. and ray being a "nice guy" let him get away with it. since it helped spread the ideas of how badly people can treat people ,based on race.[ray was one of the civil rights marchers in the early days]
even harlan ellison speaks at length about how this guy plagerised bradbury, and how nice bradbury was about it. and how he , harlan would never be that nice. anyone who stole his work would be sued into oblivion..
so there is that. im sure the play is nice. i once saw a version on an old show called white  face theatre.
and of course young people are running around trying to hold up standards of justice!,, and equality! and other things that are in essence good. but when they grab at misinterpetation, they expose themselves as socially pretty ignorant. and any truth to the meaning of the activity is lost in outbursts of emotional rash behavior. people run around shouting stop all racisim! but with out looking at what real bigotry and racisim is.
listen to bob dylans song ,,"i was so much older then,, im younger than that now,,"

11

Heh.  Your posts are good. Just kidding.
I will give it a go, though.  Let me know what ya think.

12

Thats a good song, I'll have to check out the original play to get some insight there, the internet is vast, chances are its out there

13

Ah yes, the "facts" rebuttal. The great thing about this debate is that your assumptions are fallacious--meaning I don't have to present any "facts," but can void those assumptions by pointing out the logical errors.
For example, your conception of a "conversation about race" revolves around those with whom you are conversing accepting your assumptions of "systemic inequalities." An assumption which is based on fallacious interpretation of statistics. And not just an informal fallacy, but a formal fallacy: affirmation of the consequent. Thomas Sowell (another "Uncle Tom" or "coon" that doesn't toe the line of Leftist social orthodoxy) addresses this fallacy in great detail in _The Vision of the Anointed_.
One great example of this is a Boston FRB study of mortgage approval rates. Blacks are rejected at a rate 40% higher than whites. Systemic racism, right? But on deeper analysis, the default rates for those who do get loans are the same as whites. If there was discrimination against blacks, that would require blacks to be held to higher standards than whites, meaning their default rates would be LOWER than whites. The fact they are the same indicates (though it does not prove) that the mortgage approval criteria are objective and fair across the groups evaluated. That means that black applicants are simply less qualified, or seek loans on riskier properties, than whites do in general.
And this is the crux of this "conversation:" the desire to ascribe racist intentions and dispositions to OUTCOMES, when the factors affecting those outcomes cannot even be enumerated, much less comprehended, but any person or group of people. Such is the behavior of complex systems: the parts are simple, but the system defies prediction or analysis.
This, and other such claims as I have made are easily verifiable by you. And the rhetorical burden of proof does not require me to provide you with "inks or "peer reviewed scientific studies" or any of the rest. It simply means that the data must be readily accessible to you. Only if I make a claim that is not easily verifiable do I assume ANY responsibility to "prove" it. Because if you assume I'm arguing in bad faith, you might as well clam up now because this is a pointless discussion if that is your assumption.

14



How predictable that you can't address the arguments, but instead try to preempt them with fallacious rhetorical devices. With friends like you, POCs need no enemies.

15

Thank you Andy. I really enjoy your thoughtful and eloquent posts. I once read the admonition of a black HR manager that put it this way: There is no such thing as reverse discrimination; that would be no discrimination at all. There is only discrimination and it is wrong no matter who does it.
I watched one of sweetest, nicest women I've ever known get an early promotion to Staff Sergeant when I was still in the Air Force because she was given an automatic ten points on the test for her gender. The problem was she had no technical ability and could not do the job. We were very close and she admitted to me that (a) she had joined the military for the health care and day care benefits (and to find a husband and father for her two small children), and (b) she made it through tech school by rote memorization and had no aptitude for the job.  They passed over a white male (she "beat him" by five points) who was one of the best technicians I've ever worked with. He intended to stay for twenty. Instead he got disgusted and returned to civilian life (as did I).
Anecdotal? Yes. But that isn't the only case like that I've seen over the years, I've seen many others in the civilian workplace as well. This ethereal concept of "righting the ship" isn't about creating a level playing field as you've point out. It is about ensuring a specific demographic outcome, competency and ability aside. I have worked with competent people of color and competent women over the years and setting the bar lower to accomplish a specific demographic goal in a skilled discipline is an insult to them.  And I have seen other cases where a particular member of a protected class abused workplace rules to harass and intimidate co-workers and supervisors to achieve their own ends. That being said, I am a strong proponent of true equality, where if you can do the job as well or better than I can, you deserve the same of higher pay than me. But "affirmative action" is anything but that.

16

Is segregation implicitly racist? How about the forms of segregation in which race cannot be ascribed? We segregate criminals from non-criminals. Some societies segregate one religion from another.
Segregation between blacks and whites arose in the US because of many factors other than racism, including slavery--which was practiced for all of human history and was never intrinsically racist (unless you want to claim that one African tribe taking slaves from another is racist). Another fact was that, once freed, American blacks tended to self-segregate. Yet another was the fact that American blacks had been held back socially, economically, and educationally (situations that have long since been ameliorated) BY slavery, and their integration into the rest of US society was long and difficult.
And of course, there was deep and broad racism, even among those who fought to free the slaves.

17

I appreciate that Andy. In all honesty, I don't use Facebook and I work all but maybe 3 or 4 days a month. I don't have a smart phone, and this is the only social media site I use. It honestly can take months for a story this size to find its way to me. The time doesn't change the fact it happened, and I clearly stated I'm behind the times in the post. Thanks for saying that.

18

Its scary to think such a strong segregationist movement has taken up residence again in our country. All I can think about now is how many times i saw anti bullying and LGBT advertisements with Obama's face and voice riddled throughout them. I'm sure that had a massive part to play in the development of all this. Now that the coddled feel abandoned with trump, we are left with the aftermath of a president who had no care for foresight. CartoonNetwork, which is what my little sister watches, ran a couple of those ads every hour. I remember my cringing.

19

How you gonna bring trump into it ten years back? C'mon! back that up if your gonna spout off.

20

I can see how the martin incident played a big part in stirring the pot as well. Excellent point to make in the middle of debate. Hear Hear!

21

Instead of whining when people question your immoderate rhetoric, maybe you should do a little research yourself.  This article explains a lot of the complex backstory of the incident. If you're satisfied that this is just a bunch of over-privileged children acting up, then maybe the facts of the matter aren't very important to you after all.

22



Trump jumped on the birther bandwagon in March 2011,  according to the NY Times .

23

Lets not forget that policy and poverty also go hand in hand also, as interest gets concentrated in obviously bad areas. those are the failed policies he is reffering to I believe. The ones that drive a further wedge by implying it is all hopeless. Which is the answer you get if you ask your neighbors. Thats why heroin has become so rampant. Where I live it is not uncommon to see needles on the side of road here and there. But if you drive just 2 hours, you will see this in one of the neighborhoods you mentioned. check this photo out please
https://s-media-cache-ak0.p...
Example of failed policies to "help"
Want a few examples of how many demo policies in my Tri-state area that allow for the legal possesion of heroin? Kid you not, Its legal to hold heroin for someone else if you suspect they are at risk for overdose. There are a lot of policies coming to mind after reading andy's post. He is right on the money

24

Its not a fantasy and paranoia when you can clearly witness the total degradation of infrastructure before your very eyes. I made this post because witnessing the downfall of a school, its reputation ruined, its student's lives changed forever. That is not fantasy, that is not paranoia. It effing happened. Pull your head out of your arse and look around. Your telling me you would rather deny a real event and talk about what you think things are, instead of real life. your the one living in fantasy. An auto-defensive fantasy. Which is exactly what your condemning the right for doing.

25

" So tarring 66% of southern whites or 90% of all whites in the US with the slavery and racism brush is fallacious AND false."
I was speaking strictly of people who put these things in place and agreed with these policies, which I thought was clear by the use of the word racist. I said (and I quote) "I'm sorry, but nothing you can say will ever change my mind that it was racism on the part of whites". Either you didn't see that, or understand what I was getting at? Of course there were people (lots of them) who didn't and weren't--and I never said they did or were, that would be a ridiculous claim. Glad I didn't make it.
Not going to debate the rest, as we're both right to certain degrees. I'm sure there are those who thought of blacks as not-human, and those who felt they were a much inferior human.

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